Philip Kotler and Christian Sarkar have worked on the Wicked 7 Project for the past five years. Their latest book seeks to explain how the world’s most urgent problems are interconnected.  Enrico Foglia, director of the Regenerative Marketing Institute interviews them for The Marketing Journal.

Enrico Foglia: Today, we’re diving into some uncomfortable truths with Christian Sarkar, co-author of Wicked Problems: What Can You Do in a Time of Collapse?, and Professor Philip Kotler, the father of modern marketing. Thanks for being here, gentlemen.

Philip Kotler: It’s about time we faced these issues head-on.

EF: In Wicked Problems, you say we’re facing insurmountable challenges. Why should we care about these “wicked problems,” and what makes them so insidious?

Christian Sarkar: These problems—climate collapse, income inequality, biodiversity loss—are not abstract concepts. They are existential threats to our societies and ecosystems. What makes them “wicked” is that they’re tangled in deep systems of power, greed, and exploitation. Now, in the US particularly, we see the collapse of Democracy. And no one is coming to fix it. So we find that governments and institutions are not doing their jobs – they are failing us precisely at the moment we need them most.

PK: The truth is, the world’s response so far has been pathetic. We’re letting these issues spiral out of control, and the longer we ignore them, the harder they’ll be to untangle. Our hope is that by writing a book which shows how these seven wicked problems are interconnected – we start seeing the world as it is – a living planet, where what we do to one, we do to all.

CS: The root of the problem is power and corruption. Too many corporations are controlled by a small elite that prioritizes wealth extraction over social or environmental wellbeing. Purpose becomes a smokescreen—a distraction—when it’s not backed by a real redistribution of power. If you’re not challenging the systems of privilege and exploitation that created these wicked problems in the first place, then your purpose is performative. Real change means confronting power structures head-on. Otherwise, it’s just business as usual in a nicer wrapper. Companies can’t just carry on with their old, harmful business models. We’ve seen time and time again that they’re willing to pay lip service to sustainability while profiting from the very practices that harm the planet and society.

Professor Kotler, you’ve built your career on teaching businesses how to grow. How does that relate to the collapse we’re facing with these wicked problems?

PK: The problem is that businesses have been part of the reason we’re in this mess. The whole model of relentless profit maximization has created these crises. From exploiting labor to destroying ecosystems, businesses have been complicit in accelerating these problems. And while we’re talking about growth, we need to redefine it. Growth that destroys isn’t growth—it’s cancer. If businesses don’t change their core strategy and focus on regeneration rather than extraction, they won’t survive in the long run. Degrowth sounds like a negative term – but it is a planned reduction of energy and resource use designed to bring the economy back into balance with the living world in a way that reduces inequality and improves human well-being. Isn’t that what we need?

CS: We need a new approach—one that regenerates the Common Good. This is about looking beyond the narrow self-interest of shareholders and instead focusing on the long-term health of the community, the environment, and the world at large.

Let’s dig into that, Christian. What does “regenerating the Common Good” really mean in the context of wicked problems?

CS: Regenerating the Common Good means aligning business strategies with the broader interests of society and the environment, not just focusing on the bottom line. It’s about creating value that serves the whole—communities, ecosystems, future generations. If businesses truly want to survive and thrive, they need to contribute to the regeneration of social, economic, and environmental systems, not just extract from them. This isn’t just about charity or a few nice initiatives—it’s a total restructuring of how businesses operate.

PK: This isn’t some side project. It needs to be the core of how businesses define success. The Common Good should be the yardstick by which every business decision is measured. It’s about moving beyond individual profits and asking: “How does this help the community, how does this regenerate the ecosystem, and how does this contribute to long-term social equity?” Businesses need to stop being parasites on society and start being stewards.

So, businesses must regenerate the Common Good—how do they begin?

CS: It starts with taking responsibility. Stop pretending that “business as usual” is an option anymore. Businesses need to radically shift their focus to what we call regenerative practices. This means rethinking supply chains, reimagining products, and innovating in ways that restore rather than exploit. But it also means engaging with the communities they affect. Companies must prioritize rebuilding local economies, creating shared wealth, and ensuring that their activities benefit everyone—not just a few wealthy stakeholders.

PK: Absolutely. Businesses can no longer operate in a vacuum. They need to work with governments, communities, and other sectors to tackle the wicked problems at their root. This means moving away from zero-sum thinking, where one party’s gain is another’s loss. We need to create systems of shared value, where everyone benefits. If businesses don’t engage in this kind of regenerative thinking, they’re not just failing to solve wicked problems—they’re actively worsening them.

And what does this mean for leadership? What kind of leadership is required to address these wicked problems? I know you both co-authored an article recently saying – “the 5^th P is Purpose.”

CS: It means we need leaders who are ready to disrupt the status quo. Leaders who are willing to make hard, unpopular decisions that might not pay off immediately. Leadership today has to move beyond the shallow “visionary” rhetoric. It’s about rolling up your sleeves and doing the tough work of system change. Leaders must be willing to take the heat and lead their organizations through this radical transformation. If you’re not prepared to do that, you shouldn’t be in charge.

PK: Leadership today is not about managing things in the existing system—it’s about changing the system. We need leaders who are committed to the regeneration of the Common Good, not just chasing profits. And these leaders need to understand that they can’t wait for others to take action. Every single business, every single leader, has a responsibility to act. There’s no more waiting. It’s now or never.

In your article The 5th P is Purpose, you argue that businesses must go beyond the traditional 4 Ps of marketing and embrace Purpose as a core driver of strategy. But in an era where corporate purpose is often reduced to PR spin, how can companies ensure their purpose is authentic and not just another marketing gimmick? What does it take for businesses to embed Purpose in a way that truly regenerates the Common Good?

CS: The key to authenticity is action. Purpose isn’t a slogan—it’s a commitment embedded in the company’s DNA. Businesses must align purpose with strategy, operations, and incentives, ensuring it drives real impact. If purpose is just marketing fluff, people see through it. True purpose means making hard choices—changing supply chains, reducing harm, and prioritizing the Common Good over short-term profit. Companies that fail to integrate purpose authentically will lose trust, and ultimately, their relevance.

PK: Purpose must be measurable and deeply integrated into decision-making. It’s not about lofty mission statements—it’s about how a company behaves when no one is watching. Businesses that embed purpose authentically create shared value, benefiting society while securing long-term sustainability. Purpose-driven companies attract loyal customers, committed employees, and even investors who see beyond quarterly earnings. But it must be real. Greenwashing or purpose-washing is a ticking time bomb—those who fake it will be exposed and left behind.

It sounds like you’re both saying that if businesses don’t act now, they’ll be irrelevant. What happens next if they continue business as usual?

CS: If businesses don’t act, they’ll be wiped out by the systems they’ve helped to create. The world isn’t going to keep putting up with corporate greed and environmental destruction. Our billionaires are myopic – to their own detriment.

PK: The public is waking up, and the demand for real change is going to get louder and louder. Consumers, employees, and even investors are starting to question companies that don’t have a genuine commitment to social and environmental responsibility. If businesses keep prioritizing short-term profits over the long-term health of the planet and society, they’ll be left behind. We’re already seeing the cracks in the system—democracy in decline, economic instability, climate crises, social unrest. Businesses that don’t change will simply be swallowed by this collapse. No matter how big they are, no matter how much power they have, they’ll be swept away by the tide.

Finally, what’s the one thing businesses need to stop doing right now if they want to be part of the solution?

CS: Stop pretending that small changes will cut it. Stop hiding behind buzzwords like “sustainability” while continuing to profit from systems that harm people and the planet. Business-as-usual is over. The time for half-measures and excuses is long past. If you’re not willing to regenerate the Common Good, you’re part of the problem.

PK: Stop ignoring the fact that your business is embedded in a larger ecosystem. You can’t just keep taking without giving back. It’s time to radically shift priorities—from profits at all costs to regeneration at all costs. Businesses need to realize that the only way forward is to align their success with the success of the communities and ecosystems they operate within.

You’ve both laid out a pretty damning indictment of corporate power. But if internal reforms aren’t enough, what role do governments, citizen movements, or even more radical actions play in forcing accountability?

CS: Let’s be real—expecting corporations to police themselves is a fantasy. We need structural intervention. Governments must step in to rewrite the rules of the game—close tax loopholes, break up monopolies, enforce environmental protections, cap executive pay. But we also need people power. Citizen movements, labor unions, Indigenous communities—these are the real changemakers. If we want regeneration, we need to dismantle the extractive machinery and build something better in its place. Sometimes that means breaking companies up. If a corporation is too big to be held accountable, it’s too big to exist.

PK: Regulation isn’t a dirty word—it’s essential for a functioning society. Governments have the tools, but too often they’re captured by the very interests they’re supposed to regulate. That’s where civil society steps in. Public pressure—through protests, boycotts, policy advocacy—can shift the balance. But we also need new economic models: cooperative ownership, benefit corporations, regenerative enterprises. If business can’t evolve willingly, it will be forced to evolve—or be replaced. There’s no going back to the old model. It’s dead.

Let’s hope it’s not too late.

Thanks for your time – we must try.

INTERVIEW BY ENRICO FOGLIA